Universal package managers have taken over Linux... Atleast, one of them has, and that ended up being Flatpak. In this video, we go over why Linux users love...
There’s an appimaged daemon you can install that will manage them, and it watches a bunch of folders to integrate appimages with xdg and whatever window manager you’ve got. ~/Applications looks like an easy pick, or ~/.local/bin.
Appimages you decide to keep you can just move there!
Recently I wanted to uninstall $thing. Couldn’t via the package manager. I had forgotten that it wasn’t a native package. So what was it? *scratches head* Flatpak, snap or Appimage? Aw damn, it’s an AppImage. Now where did I put the binary? *scratches head*.
Maybe you would like appimagelauncher. It allows you to define a directory for storing your appimages and you just put them in there and you can automatically launch it from the system menu as if they were installed apps. It also makes removing them easier, since they’re all in the same directory and you just remove them and the shortcuts get deleted as well
The fluxer appimage will ‘install’ itself into /opt/ without your knowledge. I think because it’s essentially an electron package similar to stoat, standard notes and discord, large parts of it can self-update without needing to bump the actual package version, but this is really shitty behaviour considering what appimages are designed to do.
This completely. Speaking as a person who’s more tech skilled than 99% of non-programmers, i can tell you that installing apps is the main tech hurdle for Linux getting mainstream adoption.
There are non-tech hurdles too, but of the actual technology being easy to use then app installation is really the only aspect left that regular people can’t do without a huge dive of tech learning that’s beyond what most people can do.
Installing on mac: click the Mac download button and follow the prompts.
Installing on Windows: click the Windows download button and follow the prompts.
Installing on Linux: there’s no Linux download button, there’s a couple of buttons that say words you’ve never heard of before. They look kinda like buttons to download an app. You click one and try to open it, but it just shows an error, etc etc etc
As a longtime Mac user, that’s not quite as easy. Some apps are only available through the Mac App Store. For applications you download there are several variants:
installers: double click and go through an install wizard with next buttons
zip files: double click to unpack, then put the app wherever you want (typically /Applications or ~/Applications)
disk images: double click to mount. Then drag and drop the app to /Applications
through macports or homebrew via command line
there are a couple of Apple system tools, that are often installed via command line like Rosetta and Xcode command line tools
Of course you can have a zip file, that contains a disk image, that then contains an installer.
For applications downloaded from the internet, you also get at least a warning when opening it. If it’s not notarized, you have to go to system settings to be able to run it. For many applications, you also need to go to settings and fiddle with sandbox settings to make them work.
New users are often challenged by all these options. There are many who end up running an app from a disk image for example.
You might also need to select the correct architecture because some applications don’t provide universal binaries for some reason.
While installation is an issue for Linux, the bigger issue is the low availability of quality commercial software. The immense fracturing between distributions creates tons of issues as well.
You CAN do those, but essentially 100% of apps that regular people are gonna want will be: click mac download -> open file -> follow prompts. That’s the point of a standard, which is not to necessarily eliminate alternatives, rather to make a single one be the default for almost 100% of standard situations.
I’d agree with that sentiment, but at least for me, if we went with all flatpacks, i’d be losing the one ability that I like about appimages, which is as a one-time-use type of “installation”. They’re kind of like those windows EXEs that you could just run in place without needing to install. very useful for stuff like raspberrypi imager where I don’t need to keep it around much
appimages also allow some sort of portable apps you can carry around. Very useful for dealing with no internet scenarios. I also use appimages for things iI use very rarely and don’t want to bother to have them being updated regularly along with the system
I like both flatpaks and appimages why does everything have to be a victory and defeat
Because it’s nice for devs to have a single package type to build per OS
Neither Flatpaks nor AppImages can provide those.
Why can’t they do that already? Just choose whichever one you want it’s trivial for me to run whichever as a user
Just not snaps.
AppImage and flatpak are fine though
Whats wrong with snaps? My only “issue” with appimages is i tend to leave them in my downloads folder and lose them
There’s an appimaged daemon you can install that will manage them, and it watches a bunch of folders to integrate appimages with xdg and whatever window manager you’ve got.
~/Applicationslooks like an easy pick, or~/.local/bin.Appimages you decide to keep you can just move there!
Why do you keep appimages? I don’t do that and now I’m wondering if I do something wrong. But I try to install from repos as much as possible.
I’ve used one or two tools that only distribute for my system as an appimage or as source code.
I can’t always be bothered to set up a compilation environment or deal with removing dependencies.
I only use one or two regularly, but it’s nice to have them integrated!
I prefer from the distro’s repos, then source, then flatpack, then appimage. Sometimes you have to take what you can get!
The appImage is the program. If you don’t keep it, you don’t have the program.
The snap store is a shit show of security issues.
Forced migration to snaps.
Performance issues.
Proprietary back end.
Slow to install
Slow to start
Eat up RAM
Eat up disk space
They screw up access to devices.
They automatically update themselves without user confirmation.
Fuck snaps. Fuck Canonical.
Gearlevel is a good app to tidy up the Appimage apss.
My issues with snaps are:
I didn’t realize, damn.
snaps are essentially ubuntu-only
I have an ~/app directory for appimages
Ty for both
Correct
Recently I wanted to uninstall $thing. Couldn’t via the package manager. I had forgotten that it wasn’t a native package. So what was it? *scratches head* Flatpak, snap or Appimage? Aw damn, it’s an AppImage. Now where did I put the binary? *scratches head*.
I present to you: https://flathub.org/en-GB/apps/it.mijorus.gearlever
I think it’s really funny that it’s a flatpak used to manage AppImages
I know right?! ;)
Maybe you would like appimagelauncher. It allows you to define a directory for storing your appimages and you just put them in there and you can automatically launch it from the system menu as if they were installed apps. It also makes removing them easier, since they’re all in the same directory and you just remove them and the shortcuts get deleted as well
The fluxer appimage will ‘install’ itself into /opt/ without your knowledge. I think because it’s essentially an electron package similar to stoat, standard notes and discord, large parts of it can self-update without needing to bump the actual package version, but this is really shitty behaviour considering what appimages are designed to do.
In ~/Downloads/
If you can run it, it shouldn’t be more than a couple of clicks to find it.
Uhh…should probably get yourself in order because that sounds like a you problem to be completely honest
It’s not that big of a deal to package in both flatpak and appimage.
Yeah, it’s called .deb
Well that’s not gonna work on rpm based distributions now is it
How is that my problem
Well let’s break it down…
You thought:
Was an acceptable response to:
Your problem was your stupidity.
But now your problem is everyone knowing about it.
Jesus fucking Christ, it’s like you had your sense of humor surgically removed.
I think you’re the one lacking a sense of humor if you thought your comment was funny instead of making you look like an ass.
Look, we get it, you didn’t get the joke.
Ah yes, the ol’ people are annoyed at the actions I chose to take, so I’ll call it a joke defence
Ah yes, the ol’ I’m constantly joking and morons get mad about it reply
It goes a long way to simplicity from both a user and dev to have only one package type to deal with and distribute.
This completely. Speaking as a person who’s more tech skilled than 99% of non-programmers, i can tell you that installing apps is the main tech hurdle for Linux getting mainstream adoption.
There are non-tech hurdles too, but of the actual technology being easy to use then app installation is really the only aspect left that regular people can’t do without a huge dive of tech learning that’s beyond what most people can do.
Installing on mac: click the Mac download button and follow the prompts.
Installing on Windows: click the Windows download button and follow the prompts.
Installing on Linux: there’s no Linux download button, there’s a couple of buttons that say words you’ve never heard of before. They look kinda like buttons to download an app. You click one and try to open it, but it just shows an error, etc etc etc
As a longtime Mac user, that’s not quite as easy. Some apps are only available through the Mac App Store. For applications you download there are several variants:
Of course you can have a zip file, that contains a disk image, that then contains an installer.
For applications downloaded from the internet, you also get at least a warning when opening it. If it’s not notarized, you have to go to system settings to be able to run it. For many applications, you also need to go to settings and fiddle with sandbox settings to make them work.
New users are often challenged by all these options. There are many who end up running an app from a disk image for example.
You might also need to select the correct architecture because some applications don’t provide universal binaries for some reason.
While installation is an issue for Linux, the bigger issue is the low availability of quality commercial software. The immense fracturing between distributions creates tons of issues as well.
You CAN do those, but essentially 100% of apps that regular people are gonna want will be: click mac download -> open file -> follow prompts. That’s the point of a standard, which is not to necessarily eliminate alternatives, rather to make a single one be the default for almost 100% of standard situations.
I’d agree with that sentiment, but at least for me, if we went with all flatpacks, i’d be losing the one ability that I like about appimages, which is as a one-time-use type of “installation”. They’re kind of like those windows EXEs that you could just run in place without needing to install. very useful for stuff like raspberrypi imager where I don’t need to keep it around much
appimages also allow some sort of portable apps you can carry around. Very useful for dealing with no internet scenarios. I also use appimages for things iI use very rarely and don’t want to bother to have them being updated regularly along with the system
Come on, you know if a dev doesn’t offer an appimage, someone is going to shit on them for it.
there can only be one standard.
But what if it doesn’t cover my specific usecase?
Compile from source
Damn, I was hoping to lead you into the relevant xkcd :p
I thought of it too :)